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#1051 2012-08-18 10:47:56

beans
Member
Registered: 2010-01-28
Posts: 5835

Re: Dedicated to all of the idiots amongst us:

Ah, the juicy details...:-)



Hi willy....

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#1052 2012-08-18 15:16:29

wilbro99
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From: San Fernando Valley
Registered: 2008-04-10
Posts: 7850
Website

Re: Dedicated to all of the idiots amongst us:

w: "The Leading Question: What if we think we know the same thing and we factually do not; how would we ascertain that that misunderstanding is in place?"

RJ: How would we ascertain misunderstanding? I'm not sure I understand the question.
How can you not?"

Hi RJ, that leading question was placed there as a lead in to the decisive question so that it would point to what I was thinking. I think there was little chance anyone would understand what I was thinking, which was my intent; and that to leave a puzzle of sorts behind.

The rest of your post I find as a very good intro into what I was thinking, so let me try to push off from there by telling you what I am thinking with respect to that misunderstanding. I will need to set the stage first, so bear with this moving of words around.

And I have another thought here, well, a question really. Do you find that there is a matter to be discussed that requires the setting of the stage upon which that matter is to be discussed, without which, the matter cannot be discussed?

Well, that turns out, very serendipitously, to be exactly what I am thinking here. If you find that there is such a matter, it then behooves us to try to set the same stage, right?




hi beanz.....

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#1053 2012-08-18 16:30:59

RJ
Member
From: New Zealand
Registered: 2011-01-29
Posts: 2804

Re: Dedicated to all of the idiots amongst us:

I think 'stage-setting' is doomed to failure before it begins

leave the limelight, the stagefright
this orchestra has no score

better to wander in the wilderness
marvel at footprints made by a beast you've never seen

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#1054 2012-08-18 17:00:55

wilbro99
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From: San Fernando Valley
Registered: 2008-04-10
Posts: 7850
Website

Re: Dedicated to all of the idiots amongst us:

Yep, makes sense. You just set your stage for me. The most you and I can do on that stage is continue posting here.

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#1055 2012-08-18 18:01:33

RJ
Member
From: New Zealand
Registered: 2011-01-29
Posts: 2804

Re: Dedicated to all of the idiots amongst us:

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-gQLpZPhwPJ0/TyVpmr0qYEI/AAAAAAAAAqo/jxWhGphhjhs/s1600/pirates-of-the-caribbean-5.jpg

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#1056 2012-08-19 14:15:26

wilbro99
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From: San Fernando Valley
Registered: 2008-04-10
Posts: 7850
Website

Re: Dedicated to all of the idiots amongst us:

An idiotic question!

What would happen if you lost your ability to think in terms of a future?

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#1057 2012-08-19 14:17:05

joe
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From: ohio
Registered: 2008-03-17
Posts: 15103
Website

Re: Dedicated to all of the idiots amongst us:

wilbro99 wrote:

An idiotic question!

What would happen if you lost your ability to think in terms of a future?

well surely there would not be a question to answer, would there?

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#1058 2012-08-19 14:20:11

Pablo Sitauskis
Member
Registered: 2010-01-17
Posts: 2008

Re: Dedicated to all of the idiots amongst us:

wilbro99 wrote:

An idiotic question!

What would happen if you lost your ability to think in terms of a future?

You'd vote for Romney/Ryan?

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#1059 2012-08-19 15:59:44

beans
Member
Registered: 2010-01-28
Posts: 5835

Re: Dedicated to all of the idiots amongst us:

wilbro99 wrote:

An idiotic question!

What would happen if you lost your ability to think in terms of a future?

What would we do with ourselves then?!

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#1060 2012-08-19 17:28:54

wilbro99
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From: San Fernando Valley
Registered: 2008-04-10
Posts: 7850
Website

Re: Dedicated to all of the idiots amongst us:

Thanks beanz:

Same idiotic question; different context!

Assume a creature that has the ability to imagine its *what was* as though it were the history of a real entity, and that that imagined identity *is* the one that turns around to face its future.

What would happen if that identity lost its ability to think in terms of a future?

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#1061 2012-08-19 17:53:15

beans
Member
Registered: 2010-01-28
Posts: 5835

Re: Dedicated to all of the idiots amongst us:

I'm sorry, I'm not getting this "future" thing...my vocabulary seems to have gone beyond. :-)

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#1062 2012-08-19 17:56:05

beans
Member
Registered: 2010-01-28
Posts: 5835

Re: Dedicated to all of the idiots amongst us:

I suppose the details depend on the particular creature, but scanning the vast creaturedom within my sphere, these types of things:

There wouldn’t be fear/anxiety or desire about tomorrow (though non-psychological fear and desire would still exist). Certain catharex-type habits might end. Stacks of deadline-based projects wouldn’t get prioritized, and might not get done without anxiety as a driver. There would be some hell to pay as a result. There would be vast expanses of space, peace…and a bluebird or two.

Ah, I nearly forgot...there wouldn't be the ability to live in thought/fantasy about oneself and the world instead of reality.

Last edited by beans (2012-08-19 18:05:57)

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#1063 2012-08-19 18:01:43

RJ
Member
From: New Zealand
Registered: 2011-01-29
Posts: 2804

Re: Dedicated to all of the idiots amongst us:

wilbro99 wrote:

Thanks beanz:

Same idiotic question; different context!

Assume a creature that has the ability to imagine its *what was* as though it were the history of a real entity, and that that imagined identity *is* the one that turns around to face its future.

What would happen if that identity lost its ability to think in terms of a future?

it would gather no nuts

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#1064 2012-08-19 19:16:47

wilbro99
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From: San Fernando Valley
Registered: 2008-04-10
Posts: 7850
Website

Re: Dedicated to all of the idiots amongst us:

RJ, I was thinking along the same lines, but with a different emphasis; like it would have to start from scratch and determine which nuts were imagined and which were not.

I mean, one cannot live on applause for very long, unless of course, you make your living that way.

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#1065 2012-08-20 01:43:36

wilbro99
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From: San Fernando Valley
Registered: 2008-04-10
Posts: 7850
Website

Re: Dedicated to all of the idiots amongst us:

An odd sort of question that evens itself out in the answer: What does it mean, to start from scratch?

It means that one gets to begin at the beginning, again, and this time, take oneself apart in the reverse order that one's self was put together.

This inside-out feat allows that one to become the proud owner of a circus act; a one-trick dog & pony show, where a dog, perched precariously on the back of a spirited pony running in circles around the center ring of the big top whilst each time around said same pony passes under a flaming ring of fire through said ring that that precariously perched pooch leaps with alacrity though and lands again on the back of said same pony.

Of course, I had the chance to pick up the UF franchise and made a one on one swap. Get your 6-pack the soonest!

cool

[edit added this brace of brackets]

Last edited by wilbro99 (2012-08-20 01:44:37)

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#1066 2012-09-03 12:21:37

Pablo Sitauskis
Member
Registered: 2010-01-17
Posts: 2008

Re: Dedicated to all of the idiots amongst us:

In honor of Willy I offer not a wonk, but a scherzo.

I have a key, which if I find and wield rightly, will open a door to my beyond.

Place yourself in the above I and repeat until nothing remains: no key, no door, no beyond, no I.

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#1067 2012-09-03 16:13:01

wilbro99
Member
From: San Fernando Valley
Registered: 2008-04-10
Posts: 7850
Website

Re: Dedicated to all of the idiots amongst us:

Pablo sez: "In honor of Willy I offer not a wonk, but a scherzo.

I have a key, which if I find and wield rightly, will open a door to my beyond.

Place yourself in the above I and repeat until nothing remains: no key, no door, no beyond, no I."

& willy, thankful for the chance to wonk, wonks:

To acquire a beyond, first, draw a circle around where you find yourself, and then forget that you have drawn that circle.

There are now two ways out; the first being seeing that the circle around you was your doing, and the second being to find yourself out of the circle by losing yourself.

There are different ways to lose yourself; one being to lose yourself in a doing, another is to give yourself to another, and yet another could be to find a new self that is out of the circle. The latter, of course, is the transcendental out.

Oh well, the orthogonal strikes again! Where you posit a trapped, I posit the trap that creates the trapped. If one is the trap, and my shtick carries that premise, the only way out is to discover that in seeing how it is created, the trap, and the trapped, negate in the same moment.

I say that the insight into this matter of self is always that whole negation, but that it may take some time to work through its resetting because of conditioning, or the inertia that trap/trapped carries with it.

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#1068 2012-09-03 16:48:26

tree
Member
Registered: 2009-01-02
Posts: 9900

Re: Dedicated to all of the idiots amongst us:

Pablo Sitauskis wrote:

In honor of Willy I offer not a wonk, but a scherzo.

I have a key, which if I find and wield rightly, will open a door to my beyond.

Place yourself in the above I and repeat until nothing remains: no key, no door, no beyond, no I.

http://parrotislandband.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/03/palm-tree.jpg

key largo

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#1069 2012-09-03 16:50:18

tree
Member
Registered: 2009-01-02
Posts: 9900

Re: Dedicated to all of the idiots amongst us:

wilbro99 wrote:

Pablo sez: "In honor of Willy I offer not a wonk, but a scherzo.

I have a key, which if I find and wield rightly, will open a door to my beyond.

Place yourself in the above I and repeat until nothing remains: no key, no door, no beyond, no I."

& willy, thankful for the chance to wonk, wonks:

To acquire a beyond, first, draw a circle around where you find yourself, and then forget that you have drawn that circle.

There are now two ways out; the first being seeing that the circle around you was your doing, and the second being to find yourself out of the circle by losing yourself.

There are different ways to lose yourself; one being to lose yourself in a doing, another is to give yourself to another, and yet another could be to find a new self that is out of the circle. The latter, of course, is the transcendental out.

Oh well, the orthogonal strikes again! Where you posit a trapped, I posit the trap that creates the trapped. If one is the trap, and my shtick carries that premise, the only way out is to discover that in seeing how it is created, the trap, and the trapped, negate in the same moment.

I say that the insight into this matter of self is always that whole negation, but that it may take some time to work through its resetting because of conditioning, or the inertia that trap/trapped carries with it.

http://t1.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcT0xDFJfeGAEyqxx0XmeeNUeLJNmLKe2QXQrl7aNRXKQoltKx5B

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#1070 2012-09-03 17:00:09

Pablo Sitauskis
Member
Registered: 2010-01-17
Posts: 2008

Re: Dedicated to all of the idiots amongst us:

http://rachmiel.org/kfa/rorschach_blot.jpg

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#1071 2012-09-03 17:01:14

Pablo Sitauskis
Member
Registered: 2010-01-17
Posts: 2008

Re: Dedicated to all of the idiots amongst us:

tree wrote:

key largo

Yummmmmmmmmmmmmmmm ... :-)

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#1072 2012-09-03 18:20:18

Pablo Sitauskis
Member
Registered: 2010-01-17
Posts: 2008

Re: Dedicated to all of the idiots amongst us:

Thanks for the wonk-back, Elder. I hoped you'd bite. :-)

wilbro99 wrote:

To acquire a beyond, first, draw a circle around where you find yourself, and then forget that you have drawn that circle.

Hold the presses: Orthogonal Alert! Orthogonal Alert!

The circle is already there. No acquiring necessary.

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#1073 2012-09-03 18:25:45

wilbro99
Member
From: San Fernando Valley
Registered: 2008-04-10
Posts: 7850
Website

Re: Dedicated to all of the idiots amongst us:

Yep, which expresses our difference rather neatly, I think.

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#1074 2012-09-03 18:45:16

tree
Member
Registered: 2009-01-02
Posts: 9900

Re: Dedicated to all of the idiots amongst us:

yeah

http://t3.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcT00ZlHoaGUiHROrORZRqCIpk0OiFvlDfgyGC4Tr0zTBFvSlXwQ

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#1075 2012-09-03 19:15:20

Pablo Sitauskis
Member
Registered: 2010-01-17
Posts: 2008

Re: Dedicated to all of the idiots amongst us:

wilbro99 wrote:

Yep, which expresses our difference rather neatly, I think.

Et vive la différence!

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