KFA - Krishnamurti Foundation of America
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Kindly be mindful of the following points regarding the forum. Dialogue is thinking together - it isn’t debate - and it's inquiring together without end point or agenda. People come into the dialogue from their own place of understanding, which is not going to be your place of understanding. We’re here to communicate together, learn together and gain insight into our own thought; to receive and share our observations, not impose our views on others. Address the comments in a polite, considerate manner. By all means, ask for clarification, but challenge the comment, not the commentator. We don’t know enough about the others to make those judgments and we’re here to learn about ourselves, not to correct another's perceived personality flaws. If a comment brings an emotional response, look at that. Do you feel the need to defend? To attack? Time for some looking inward. Self protection results in war. Besides, the war is in each of us. Stop that war, and the rest will take care of itself. (For some suggestions on the nature of dialogue, please click here)
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#126 2012-06-02 17:37:44
Re: Zen and K
RJ wrote:
joe wrote:
riddle me this RJ--is this not a social outlet for you?
no,
but perhaps that thought you had the other day (yesterday?) that it might be time to leave yourself was worth giving a little more breathing space (hint: it may be necessary to release some wind in order to do just that) though of course that is entirely up to you.
but anyway since you are asking, remind me why you are here again?
well hang on a bit...this is not a social outlet for you, you say. What is it for you then? Are you here to help yourself, or are you here to help others, both, or some other reason entirely?
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#127 2012-06-02 17:45:49
- RJ
- Member
- From: New Zealand
- Registered: 2011-01-29
- Posts: 2804
Re: Zen and K
joe wrote:
RJ wrote:
joe wrote:
riddle me this RJ--is this not a social outlet for you?
no,
but perhaps that thought you had the other day (yesterday?) that it might be time to leave yourself was worth giving a little more breathing space (hint: it may be necessary to release some wind in order to do just that) though of course that is entirely up to you.
but anyway since you are asking, remind me why you are here again?well hang on a bit...this is not a social outlet for you, you say. What is it for you then? Are you here to help yourself, or are you here to help others, both, or some other reason entirely?
you asked a question, got an answer and then a question in return,
you should answer your question before you get to ask another
unless of course you think you occupy a priveleged position
priv·i·leged
Adjective:
1.Having special rights, advantages, or immunities.
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#128 2012-06-02 17:54:23
Re: Zen and K
for shit's sake RJ, is this kindergarten? Ok fine, I am here because I am here. I have reasons I tell myself sometimes for why I am here but alas they are just lent meaning, aren't they? For example, I can tell myself it is a social outlet, because on some level it most certainly is a place where we, all of us, commune. Anyone saying differently must be blinded by something to discount the social movement entirely or the influence of it for reason to be here. So, I hope that will suffice as an answer to your question, and hopefully a complete answer instead of a simple yes or no.
Would you care to elaborate on your reasons for being here and are you sure that a comprehensive answer does not include a social element? Obviously I have an opinion about that.
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#129 2012-06-02 18:12:56
- RJ
- Member
- From: New Zealand
- Registered: 2011-01-29
- Posts: 2804
Re: Zen and K
joe wrote:
for shit's sake RJ, is this kindergarten? Ok fine, I am here because I am here. I have reasons I tell myself sometimes for why I am here but alas they are just lent meaning, aren't they? For example, I can tell myself it is a social outlet, because on some level it most certainly is a place where we, all of us, commune. Anyone saying differently must be blinded by something to discount the social movement entirely or the influence of it for reason to be here. So, I hope that will suffice as an answer to your question, and hopefully a complete answer instead of a simple yes or no.
Would you care to elaborate on your reasons for being here and are you sure that a comprehensive answer does not include a social element? Obviously I have an opinion about that.
Ok, I am here because i am here too...
Are you happy for me to give the same answer or do you feel it is a piece of evasive bum fluff from someone familiar with attack but woefully weak on defence?
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#130 2012-06-02 18:14:36
#131 2012-06-02 18:15:42
#132 2012-06-02 18:27:08
- RJ
- Member
- From: New Zealand
- Registered: 2011-01-29
- Posts: 2804
Re: Zen and K
joe wrote:
is it a real answer for you? If it is then sure, that is fine
thank God, I'm off the hook then.
Now, I am sure there is a long line of other people who would like to meet you so would you mind if I just slipped past you now then please, there's a good chap.
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#133 2012-06-02 19:10:36
#134 2012-06-02 19:11:52
#135 2012-06-03 10:04:39
#136 2012-06-03 10:06:53
#137 2012-06-03 10:11:38
#138 2012-06-03 10:13:21
Re: Zen and K
suzakico wrote:
So, you have been in this forum for long...
carrying water and chopping woods?
whether it is the forum, work, dinner with family it is not much different, is it? If the work is the work the place is secondary.
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#139 2012-06-03 10:17:40
#140 2012-06-03 10:24:11
#141 2012-06-03 10:26:54
#142 2012-06-03 10:32:55
Re: Zen and K
suzakico wrote:
If you see someone in distress and you offer help (snow). Yet, the person does not take it.
What do you do?
enjoy the fragrance of the flower that still stands before me. How can I not? I can not force another to smell it.
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#143 2012-06-03 10:35:16
#144 2012-06-03 10:40:55
#145 2012-06-03 10:43:08
#146 2012-06-03 11:04:50
Re: Zen and K
the pain of another is the pain of myself, the pain of humanity. When I begin to choose what I want from it, bliss instead of pain, for example, then what I feel is only a product of desire. Absent that choosing life is ongoing and filled with many things.
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#147 2012-06-03 11:09:40
#148 2012-06-03 11:15:29
Re: Zen and K
suzakico wrote:
So, you want no-desire in life?
and that corresponds to no-choosing?
no, that is not quite it...if I want no desire it is already too late isn't it? What I am saying is that the pain seen in another, just as the clouds that form in the sky, is impossible to ignore if the eyes are open to what is there. If I choose to ignore it it does not make the clouds disappear nor the pain, it only means I have chosen to disengage from what is there, and desire is what made that choice. Is that any clearer?
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#149 2012-06-03 11:21:05
Re: Zen and K
joe wrote:
suzakico wrote:
So, you want no-desire in life?
and that corresponds to no-choosing?no, that is not quite it...if I want no desire it is already too late isn't it? What I am saying is that the pain seen in another, just as the clouds that form in the sky, is impossible to ignore if the eyes are open to what is there. If I choose to ignore it it does not make the clouds disappear nor the pain, it only means I have chosen to disengage from what is there, and desire is what made that choice. Is that any clearer?
No.
But it is you to answer and if you do diligently and truthfully, that is all I am curious about - at least for now.
So, let's leave it with that.
Good day,
Kio
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