KFA - Krishnamurti Foundation of America

Eden

If you have already changed yourself, your behavior, your language, your guru, your deep interest in incessant quarrels, then yes, you have answered my question. But before all these very basics my friend, what you day dream about life as oneness are just harmful ideas to your brain because you keep playing with the false and contradiction.

What is it that you are so proud about yourself or the society, the little forum society between a few of you first, here, that you see the corruption as an old stale conclusion? To talk to the wise, I don’t have enough but just listening. And to talk to a fool, I don’t have enough either but to listen and let it go.

As for daydreaming of oneness....that's pretty funny, since it is a fact that the body is swimming in it every second.  Now it's true that the body can be opening or closing to feeling the oneness it is swimming in, but clearly you are unable to distinguish between bodies that are opening to feel that, and those that are closing.

Eden wrote:

snguyen wrote:

Eden

If you have already changed yourself, your behavior, your language, your guru, your deep interest in incessant quarrels, then yes, you have answered my question. But before all these very basics my friend, what you day dream about life as oneness are just harmful ideas to your brain because you keep playing with the false and contradiction.

What is it that you are so proud about yourself or the society, the little forum society between a few of you first, here, that you see the corruption as an old stale conclusion? To talk to the wise, I don’t have enough but just listening. And to talk to a fool, I don’t have enough either but to listen and let it go.

Life is always new. Even the conclusions projected by minds that fragment life is still the seamless movement of the One life that is always new.  Even your body's particular conclusions will end before long and be transmuted by life into greater openness, just as I am doing this very minute. 

As for this word "changed", that is very funny.  There is no such thing. At best you could say there is "change", present tense. The body is always changing, thus what everything feels like, is always changing.

I can also conclude that life is all so old and everything is touched by thought and memory. That is very easy to observe. From the old repetitive memory you run on with old ideas that life is always new. It is still the idea and from that idea you have your saying isn’t it? If it is always new, how can you recognize it?

The new has no words and no need for description but how does that bring change into your life besides mere assertions that soon behave in the old corrupted way?

Eden wrote:

Every fragmented mind measures and gauges love or intelligence or openness by matching another mind to their own particular flavor of fragmentation.  It's plainly obvious.  Every once in a while someone comes along that 'feels' so loving that they may throw everything out the window, but until then, the standard of measurement is their own prism of fragmentation and how that rainbow hits the wall.  If it matches, then presto, it is the ultimate.  If it matches K's rainbow, then presto, it is the ultimate.

There is no need for any guru, influence, dependency to observe facts that happen all around and under your nose. People are a lot of time just stupid, gullible, incredibly irrational.
At times I wonder if I need to resort to my own theory about the variety of people on earth. It is incredible that people are just on auto pilot, act blindly in a certain way they act and never stop to question and examine life. My theory for fun is that, people reflect a complete spectrum of animals, some are violent in behavior and face, some are naïve and easily exploited, some are just careless and casual all life.

Judgment? Why not? It is to look at it with the highest energy possible, with intelligence and end it, the corruption in oneself and not to come back wrangling over it that I love you, you don’t love me, the childish stuff.

That seems to be a very simple question but for me it has become an open ended, infinite possibility not for me but actually for life to take over the course of action and revelation.

But to come back to the kindergarten classroom, to question life, to be full of curiosity, full of sincerity and cheerfulness and openness, like children are, is what we adults lose them and fall into routine grooves of a mechanical life. Why do we transition into this uncreative and machinery way of life where we lose all unlimited curiosity? What is life as you know of it? Unless you are half asleep or dreaming and therefore content within a little pattern or a recognition of life as such and such, agreeing with any theory which is always limited, you will not lose this great sense looking at life.

When you know you are trapped then the thing is over or at least it has a chance. What if you don’t know you are trapped, conditioned to believe that life is this or that? How do you discover, find out, go beyond everything put together by thought which is experience that is screening everything you perceive, your instrument of looking, if you don’t question and examine everything?

You limit life by your limited perception, but when you destroy all the crippling factors, be discontent with everything, then eventually your perception is not limited by anything. Then life takes over the course of action and revelation. Do you trust that when you leave everything aside to take care of life, and not your own little theory, life will take care of you, for there is only one?

joe wrote:

snguyen wrote:

Do you trust that when you leave everything aside to take care of life, and not your own little theory, life will take care of you, for there is only one?

If trust is there then thinking is there with it...beyond belief and trust is observation of what happens.  Sometimes what happens is life takes care of you by relieving you of everything you have. Careful what you wish for, si, you just might get it.

Hahaha, I feel so good and need a laugh, joe, truly honestly.

So we go as far as it is safe. But truth is not limited by how far or how safe or unsafe things are. To truly discover what it is, the truth of existence and beyond, don’t you have to go beyond all limiting things to find out? If you put any limit in the bargain for truth, what you find will be the limit you stop yourself at. Is that not clear? But I know where the confusion is and why it becomes a deadlock for many people.

I am talking about a trust which is a state of mind that is beyond doubt. How can thinking be trust if not also be doubt or just confusion or an escape belief? How can you trust your thinking when it is, really, the influence of the dead past? How can you trust a dead past unless you are the dead past yourself? That whole thing called thinking is never life in which trust and true security are.

Now, the difficulty is identification. Though you talk and like to negate identification, and statements like not minding what happens, life is what happens, seem to tell you don’t identify with things, but really you are just saying words that have no actuality in you. I would ask what you identify yourself with that you are afraid of losing. Do you identify, or actually are stuck in your so called conventional truth, with your body, or family, or ideas, or the slow decay that we call living? If so, of course there is fear of losing, of misfortune. But the other is not fear or such silly things that are dead, destroyed, gone. The other is an enlightened mind, a mind of light. It is a complete mystery to a particular mind whose only ability is the old thought.

All these things: security, fear, understanding, love, and such are all so silly, inadequate, tainted and relevant in the realm of thought and time, the empty form discarded when the mind is enlightened and touches the impossible to put in words. 

So no matter what you say, no matter how “wisely” constructed, it is still the child of thought, if you don’t actually destroy it all and from there talk in a manner without any limit.

Thats alright. Haha. I dont know.

Laughing with you snyugen....:-) you're the only one itseems in this thread that seems to be interested in all this, change or what you call it and thanks for sharing your observations. :-)

armchair quarterbacks never get hit...

snguyen wrote:

So, to change and bring about a new way of life where you are free from fear and sorrow, from death and life, from belief and non belief, from having a life of your own, is the most beautiful thing to do. And change is not a static thing. It is the mysterious movement of death and new born life to be dead and reborn again. When you gather enough of this new thing, you must have an impact on society, on the corrupted old.

Very well said, snguyen and nicely put.  Can feel this beautiful energy of change, newness flowing thru your words...wonderfully so.

Laughing still...snguyen is cool, I mean his posts carry that energy of inquiry, change, revolution which is somewhat rare.  enjoyed reading all his wonderful observations and off to have a wonderful lunch with the universe...:-)

Don't mistake me, I think Si is a good fellow as well but addressing that is not my intent.