KFA - Krishnamurti Foundation of America
You are not logged in.
Announcement
Kindly be mindful of the following points regarding the forum. Dialogue is thinking together - it isn’t debate - and it's inquiring together without end point or agenda. People come into the dialogue from their own place of understanding, which is not going to be your place of understanding. We’re here to communicate together, learn together and gain insight into our own thought; to receive and share our observations, not impose our views on others. Address the comments in a polite, considerate manner. By all means, ask for clarification, but challenge the comment, not the commentator. We don’t know enough about the others to make those judgments and we’re here to learn about ourselves, not to correct another's perceived personality flaws. If a comment brings an emotional response, look at that. Do you feel the need to defend? To attack? Time for some looking inward. Self protection results in war. Besides, the war is in each of us. Stop that war, and the rest will take care of itself. (For some suggestions on the nature of dialogue, please click here)
Make friends across the globe, post your photos and videos, write a blog or start a discussion, just go to jkrishnamurti.ning.com
#701 2012-07-06 10:53:48
- hermann
- Member
- Registered: 2008-04-28
- Posts: 5424
Re: What is the origin of goodness?
hermann wrote:
As the squirrel employs gravity to construct its fabulous life style, so I want to live with the known - with my conditioning - with the thing that is me. As it is, I'm imprisoned in the self. So what is it that has to happen to change my life?
Not much, just a steady reading of the me in operation.
Offline
#702 2012-07-07 08:45:37
- hermann
- Member
- Registered: 2008-04-28
- Posts: 5424
Re: What is the origin of goodness?
The contradiction is that when the self is operating there is no observation, and when there is observation the self isn't operating. But maybe there is no contradiction: see the danger, and Seeing takes over.
Offline
#703 2012-07-08 00:04:45
- hermann
- Member
- Registered: 2008-04-28
- Posts: 5424
Re: What is the origin of goodness?
hermann wrote:
The contradiction is that when the self is operating there is no observation, and when there is observation the self isn't operating. But maybe there is no contradiction: see the danger, and Seeing takes over.
But I'm not seeing the danger. Not as an actuality. It's no better than theory. But can I not enter into that logic and see how my lack of seeing is shaping my life? And isn't that true of most of the contributions here? They only show the paralysis of the posters - often in the form of strutting their purported wisdom.
Is there anything I can do to go from rational acceptance to actual seeing? What is the stumbling block here? How am I to see that rational acceptance is the stumbling block? I confuse rational acceptance with seeing and am paralyzed by that confusion. I fail to see the harm done here.
Offline
#704 2012-07-08 00:07:55
- hermann
- Member
- Registered: 2008-04-28
- Posts: 5424
Re: What is the origin of goodness?
What exactly is the harm done?
Offline
#705 2012-07-08 00:17:25
- hermann
- Member
- Registered: 2008-04-28
- Posts: 5424
Re: What is the origin of goodness?
A confused mind - willfully confused. None of us are ending that confusion.
Offline
#706 2012-07-08 00:36:18
- hermann
- Member
- Registered: 2008-04-28
- Posts: 5424
Re: What is the origin of goodness?
We're stuck in the known. Seeing occurs in the field of the unknown.
Offline
#707 2012-07-08 00:40:57
- hermann
- Member
- Registered: 2008-04-28
- Posts: 5424
Re: What is the origin of goodness?
Stuck in the naming process.
Offline
#708 2012-07-12 14:35:15
- hermann
- Member
- Registered: 2008-04-28
- Posts: 5424
Re: What is the origin of goodness?
The naming process is ego-enhancing.
Offline
#709 2012-07-12 15:11:00
- hermann
- Member
- Registered: 2008-04-28
- Posts: 5424
Re: What is the origin of goodness?
Joy is outside the ego, and the ego can do nothing about it. They are forever incompatible.
Offline
#710 2012-07-13 04:48:40
- night
- Member
- From: California
- Registered: 2010-11-21
- Posts: 934
Re: What is the origin of goodness?
ego is just the sum of your experiences. Big deal, so what? Are you going to talk about it until the end of your days?
Offline
#711 2012-07-13 07:05:43
- hermann
- Member
- Registered: 2008-04-28
- Posts: 5424
Re: What is the origin of goodness?
Why act so superior? Aren't you caught in it, blind to your own machinations?
Offline
#712 2012-07-13 19:06:22
- night
- Member
- From: California
- Registered: 2010-11-21
- Posts: 934
Re: What is the origin of goodness?
Is this how you welcome feedback in your life, hermann?
I am not caught, there is no acting, just your reading of some words and your feeling associated with it. You have being talking about the ego on this forum for years, and then you complain about being called on it. The ego is really a small thing of not very much importance, much less than you are assigning it. Yet I asked you a question, and you did not answer it (except with another question, which is kind of a dodge).
Offline
#713 2012-07-13 23:37:47
- hermann
- Member
- Registered: 2008-04-28
- Posts: 5424
Re: What is the origin of goodness?
Yes, I did ask you a question. But apparently you're not interested. So be it.
Offline
#714 2012-07-14 21:57:18
- bruce sean
- Member
- From: Los Angeles
- Registered: 2009-08-13
- Posts: 12155
Re: What is the origin of goodness?
night wrote:
ego is just the sum of your experiences. Big deal, so what? Are you going to talk about it until the end of your days?
The ego IS a big deal: people suffer and die because of it, and to say it is only natural is just an excuse for not looking at it.
Offline
#715 2012-07-15 08:47:16
- LMP
- Member
- From: Sweden, City: Helsingborg
- Registered: 2010-12-26
- Posts: 997
Re: What is the origin of goodness?
bruce sean wrote:
night wrote:
ego is just the sum of your experiences. Big deal, so what? Are you going to talk about it until the end of your days?
The ego IS a big deal: people suffer and die because of it, and to say it is only natural is just an excuse for not looking at it.
When there is this freedom from suffering, what is the relationship between two human beings? What do you value?
Offline
#716 2012-07-15 11:26:50
- bruce sean
- Member
- From: Los Angeles
- Registered: 2009-08-13
- Posts: 12155
Re: What is the origin of goodness?
Are you asking me theoretically-what will happen after suffering is no more? Or practically, it's already gone?
Offline
#717 2012-07-15 12:14:32
- LMP
- Member
- From: Sweden, City: Helsingborg
- Registered: 2010-12-26
- Posts: 997
Re: What is the origin of goodness?
bruce sean wrote:
Are you asking me theoretically-what will happen after suffering is no more? Or practically, it's already gone?
Im asking you practically.
Offline
#718 2012-07-15 15:30:22
- night
- Member
- From: California
- Registered: 2010-11-21
- Posts: 934
Re: What is the origin of goodness?
bruce sean wrote:
night wrote:
ego is just the sum of your experiences. Big deal, so what? Are you going to talk about it until the end of your days?
The ego IS a big deal: people suffer and die because of it, and to say it is only natural is just an excuse for not looking at it.
I don't remember engaging you here. Actually in your case i would suggest you study what 'being a prick' is.
Offline
#719 2012-07-15 15:38:56
- night
- Member
- From: California
- Registered: 2010-11-21
- Posts: 934
Re: What is the origin of goodness?
hermann wrote:
Yes, I did ask you a question. But apparently you're not interested. So be it.
It is an accepted form of discourse to answer a question first before asking one back. And I asked you first. Life is too short to waste it on deaf ears.
Offline
#720 2012-07-15 15:52:58
- hermann
- Member
- Registered: 2008-04-28
- Posts: 5424
Re: What is the origin of goodness?
I think I've been as clear as I could. If that isn't enough, so be it.
Offline
#721 2012-07-18 22:20:08
- bruce sean
- Member
- From: Los Angeles
- Registered: 2009-08-13
- Posts: 12155
Re: What is the origin of goodness?
night wrote:
bruce sean wrote:
night wrote:
ego is just the sum of your experiences. Big deal, so what? Are you going to talk about it until the end of your days?
The ego IS a big deal: people suffer and die because of it, and to say it is only natural is just an excuse for not looking at it.
I don't remember engaging you here. Actually in your case i would suggest you study what 'being a prick' is.
If the ego looked in the mirror it would see that it IS a big deal; not looking, it considers to be a small affair. So looking changes the perspective.
Offline
#722 2012-07-18 22:25:27
- bruce sean
- Member
- From: Los Angeles
- Registered: 2009-08-13
- Posts: 12155
Re: What is the origin of goodness?
LMP wrote:
bruce sean wrote:
Are you asking me theoretically-what will happen after suffering is no more? Or practically, it's already gone?
Im asking you practically.
Practically, from my own experience, a relationship may take place when one doesn't exist: THIS IS THE ONLY CASE-SCENARIO WHEN A RELATIONSHIP IS POSSIBLE.
That means no values whatsoever, but whatever happens to be happening at the moment-no values, no ideals.
Conflict may exist around you, but when you don't exist you are not helping spreading it around: on the contrary, it (you not existing) nips it in the bud.
Offline