KFA - Krishnamurti Foundation of America

No response wilbro to why I assumed you chuckled. why was that I wondered. ?

here it is babs, I was waiting for the first page to come to an end before I posted.



babsez: "wilbro, sure any effort to do this will maintain it, Is that what your laughing about. This is why K, I feel, said there is no how. in other words the you cannot bring this about. It starts surfacing, erupting all the time, or do you feel it is you that puts all your thoughts and feelings in your own body, like YOU are in control over what surfaces?????"

I am not sure what I was laughing about; usually humor breaks things up.

On that choice business; what if that choice were not really a choice, but a way of choosing across an absolute gap that allows thought to move?

You see what I mean? I can't answer your question because I see something behind the curtain those words are written upon. What if that choice were only the symptom, an not the solution?

"You will see from this why my view of a choice differs from yours, in the event that I can speak of your having such, for the difference is precisely that yours prevents a choice." (Kierkegaard; Either/Or, tr. Hannay, p. 483)

wilbro, try this on for size.

Our conditioning fuels that if one behaves badly there will be a consequence, I get the feeling that it is this belief that makes one feel bad about oneself, and as such not live up to there potential, but ultimately come mother Teresa, come Hitler, come me or you, there is no after life consequence and that is hard to feel. It implies that life ultimately has no meaning. No point. One could live a hellish life,and for what. NOTHING. Just a dream, perhaps a grotesque dream. For me its about breaking free from the dream, aka, knowing that it is one.

No not to me it doens't . Perhaps its become I am not so clever with the use of words, Sometimes I am, but NO, I didn't feel this was clear. There Is imo, alot to this situation.

Ok, babs, nothing it is. Tell me all you can about this sense of nothingness?

What does it smell like? What does it taste like? What does it feel like?

Is it like this?

"I am at the end of my rope. I am nauseated by life; it is insipid—without salt and meaning. If I were hungrier than Pierrot I would not choose to eat the explanation people offer. One sticks a finger into the ground to smell what country one is in; I stick my finger into the world—it has no smell. Where am I? What does it mean to say: the world? What is the meaning of that word? Who tricked me into this whole thing and leaves me standing here? Who am I? How did I get into the world? Why was I not asked about it, why was I not informed of the rules and regulations but just thrust into the ranks as if I had been bought from a peddling shanghaier of human beings? How did I get involved in this big enterprise called actuality? Why should I be involved? Isn’t it a matter of choice? And if I am compelled to be involved, where is the manager—I have something to say about this. Is there no manager? To whom shall I make my complaint? (Kierkegaard; Repetition, tr. Hong, p. 200)

babs, Kierkegaard is a gate keeper, at least, I see him as such. I have a word doc that has 783 quotes I copied off from his works that I see addressing that gate. I can send it to you if you so desire:

wilbro99@yahoo.com

I can also send you my 'guide of sorts' on gate travel, if you are so interested.

you bait the hookah and see what bites...

Dedicated to Stumps: What is this letting business?

Let there be two movements that do not occupy the same space, and let those two movements meet at the same time.

Let two absolutely different movements meeting at the same time creates quite a beat between the two.

Let an at-once difference creates a between that pulsates.

Let it is the heart of the universe, and so long as those two movements meet at-once, that is, at the same time, that heart will beat.

Look closely; the movement that pulsated through those four states of letting exemplifies that very difference being spoken to. The movement exposed is a cyclic movement of back and forth between two absolutely different perspectives meeting in the same place.

Think about letting the notion of being subjective or being objective enter your noggin as two absolutely different perspectives crammed into to one very confused creature trying to make sense of where its identity was to be found in such goings on.

See, Stumps, the only way to control that puppy is get in it and figure out how to slow it down, to give enough space between the flip and the flop, so that old associations may be broken.

And what remains? Hint? It's a 4 lettre word!

the moment you think the story is about babs.. babu walks in hehe

("...and the manager said 'Sharkey?.. he's not at his desk right now...can i take a message?')

Babu wrote:

kirsten wrote:

the moment you think the story is about babs.. babu walks in hehe

Yeah the story that i was talking about, was all the muck and maya that became so entrenched into who and what i thought i was. NOT feeding it, or simply ignoring it. (an action that it didn't seem to pleased about, almost as if its very existance was threatened) well that took time, and part of the story is the fear of what remains if one is no longer so entraped. For me it was a little bit like. MY GOD, you mean, Ive spent nearly 50 years and for what. NO reward, no status, no nothing. YOU mean to tell me, that it has all just been pointless, like pointless as in. completely up in smoke. GONE. No wonder people cling to what has been, Carry it with them, as the things itself. Anyway, just felt the urge to talk about it.

thanks for sharing....(again)

wilbro99 wrote:

Babu, I think I have that Gate puzzle worked out. If so, then there is at the least one solution to it.

Let it be a finding, which it must be if we can find ourselves talking about it.

Let the finding be a new way of finding oneself, and in that finding, find that the old way of finding oneself was its only mistake.

Now, in going into the gate, I find myself mistakenly, when I get into the gate, I trade the wrong finding for the correct finding, and since I am no longer that old finding, as a fact, I never went through.

If that is what the change is, that surely is a solution to the puzzle of the gate.

beans wrote:

Psst...leafy, that might be a clue that it's the wrong gate you're sauntering around.

what gate?